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#659037 - 07/02/09 04:55 PM
What happens to old record producers?
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slider
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Registered: 08/26/04
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Just thinking about the career trajectory of record producers. You start as an assistant engineer, pulling cables, setting up mics. You work hard, sweep up the studio at the end of sessions, and if all goes well, you become an engineer. After doing this X amount of years, if you have the drive and talent, you become a producer.
If the Gods smile on you, you become a popular producer. It's a fashion thing- the hot producer of the month. You get points on records, make fabulous dough, and then one day, fashion moves on, and you're yesterday's news. What then? Some go on to producing 'baby bands'- a friend of mine years ago was stoked to work with Dr. Richie Moore, of Led Zeppelin fame, for only X thousand dollars. Some move on to soundtracks, movies, TV. Some probably go back to jingles, industrials, etc.
In the list below, which could've gone on for pages, some have gone on to the Big Studio in the Sky, at least one is in jail, some are still getting the big bucks.
Would appreciate your knowledgeable thoughts on the career trajectory of record producers. (Is record producer an archaic term? Maybe MP3 producer is more accurate.)
Roy Thomas Baker
Richard Perry
Giorgio Moroder
Bob Rock
Quincy Jones
Phil Ramone
Dust Brothers
Chemical Brothers
Linda Perry
Phil Spector
Arif Mardin
Bob Clearmountain
Brian Eno
Dallas Austin
Danger Mouse
David Briggs
Terry Date
Gus Dudgeon
Mitch Easter
Jack Douglas
Ahmet Ertegun
Flood
Nigel Godrich
Glyn Johns
Orrin Keepnews
Gary Katz
Wyclef Jean
Eddie Kramer
Mutt Lange
Jimmy Iovine
Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis
Daniel Lanois
Don Landee
Patrick Leonard
Butch Vig
Steve Albini
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#659039 - 07/02/09 05:07 PM
Re: What happens to old record producers?
[Re: slider]
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Troublepuss
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Yeah, whatever happened to that Phil Spector?
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#659041 - 07/02/09 05:12 PM
Re: What happens to old record producers?
[Re: Troublepuss]
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Quest4BetterPop
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Registered: 06/13/07
Posts: 3180
Loc: Northern NJ
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Interesting topic and question.
I've often wondered what happened to Roy Thomas Baker, one of my favorite producers. He got great sounds with the Cars, Queen and others but what's he been up to in recent years?
_________________________
"I wouldn't even think of playing music if I was born in these times."
-- Bob Dylan, 2001
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#659045 - 07/02/09 05:25 PM
Re: What happens to old record producers?
[Re: slider]
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NARAS1
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Registered: 03/17/06
Posts: 375
Loc: London
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Your going to open up a serious can of worms here.
Record producer means (producer of the sound recording so the term "Record" producer is and will always be valid.
The route from tea boy/runner to producer, which most on your list came from, nearly doesn't exist anymore because the studio structure doesn't exist as it has for decades. It was widely accepted that there was no better way to become a real producer than to be trained in a major studio, under the tutelage of successful if not legendary people, working on real recordings headed to the top of the charts. These studios would traditionally get anywhere from 50-100 letters per week from kids looking to get in the door, most of whom were unqualified to do anything.
One had to be so relentlessly persistent to even get in the door, that this was the first level of filtering. I was trained in a major commercial studio, and if I told you the effort it took to get in the door you probably wouldn't believe me. That effort got me through the first level of filtering out, and I was handed a toilet brush. In time it also got me under the tutelage of three of the greatest producers that ever lived, and an education that couldn't be had at Berklee or Full Sail if I had gone there for twenty years.
The money that these schools charge for an education that in 90% of the cases will never see career light of day, is obscene.
Most older successful producers enjoy life and do (musically) whatever they want. Many work with young acts of their choice, at their own leisure. When I retire I will buy ocean front property have a studio on the property, and get involved with the local music scene there, kids music education foundations, and working with whomever I want.
The beat programming flavor of the moment half-talents that you mention didn't come from the old pathway. There are plenty of relatively young great producers that can go into Abbey Road 1 and do a London Philharmonic session for Celine Dion. You should separate the pack when discussing them.
Pro Tools and the lack of filtering talent have resulted in the dumbing down of the record business. Pitch correcting cute Disney Channel widgets to the eighth note, and getting a reality TV show to drive them, is not the path to a sustainable career.
Taking chances on real talent and songs is.
Most of the older legends that have mentored me are so gifted that any young singer would benefit greatly from their expertise.
But they are no longer interested in the game, particularly with the collapse of the business.
Many on your list were much more than the producer of the month.
Two cents from someone that is almost an old producer.
Edited by NARAS1 (07/03/09 02:19 PM)
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#659047 - 07/02/09 06:21 PM
Re: What happens to old record producers?
[Re: NARAS1]
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Eephus
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I'm assuming that the list is supposed to be a general "big name" rundown. If so, the most immediate glaring omission I see is Chris Thomas.
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#659052 - 07/02/09 06:40 PM
Re: What happens to old record producers?
[Re: Eephus]
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teverett
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Many -- perhaps most -- on the list didn't start as engineers. Musicians, someone who comes up with the money (or a good line of chatter), proclaims the act the future of rock and roll, sleeps with the artist, married the boss's daughter, etc. are all "qualifications" for the role of record producer.
Ahmet has no musical background, nor did Jerry (who'd been a writer for Billboard) or Jac, who was, essentially, a fan.
And there are successful ones from all of those backgrounds and more. Ultimately, what counts are "ears" and an ability to communicate, persuade, or leave well enough alone.
Edited by teverett (07/02/09 06:54 PM)
Edit Reason: add more stuff
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#659054 - 07/02/09 06:45 PM
Re: What happens to old record producers?
[Re: teverett]
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jayperri
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Registered: 07/02/08
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Um, you better hope Albini doesn't see his name listed (c'mon, the guy is an ENGINEER, as he's wont to point out ad nauseum) or you might be subjected to a an expletive-laden (and lengthy) screed.
Also, didn;t Roy Thomas Baker work on that last abortion of a Smashing Pumkins album? I think he also produced the Darkness's second platter, but that was a while back now.
_________________________
Some things are solid gold we thought were only tin....
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#659055 - 07/02/09 06:48 PM
Re: What happens to old record producers?
[Re: Eephus]
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slider
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Registered: 08/26/04
Posts: 1492
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Thanks, Naras1, that's the kind of reply I and a lot of people read VR for.
I'm assuming that the list is supposed to be a general "big name" rundown. If so, the most immediate glaring omission I see is Chris Thomas.
Like I said, I could've made a list that went on for pages. Other glaring omissions:
George Martin
Andrew Loog Oldham
Kit Lambert
many, many more...
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#659057 - 07/02/09 06:52 PM
Re: What happens to old record producers?
[Re: slider]
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Ditka
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Registered: 01/24/00
Posts: 414
Loc: The Frozen Tundra of Fly Over ...
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Roy Thomas Baker - took a boat load of money from Universal to help Axl finish Chinese Democracy. I'm sure got plenty of points on all his classic rock hits.
Richard Perry - not sure
Giorgio Moroder - probably somewhere in Europe sleeping on a bed made of $100 bills. Justput out a cool book on record collecting.
Bob Rock - Nickelback, right?
Quincy Jones - doesn't need to work, but has branched off into other media.
Phil Ramone - not sure, but did something recently. Krall? Bubble?
Dust Brothers - not sure
Chemical Brothers - not sure
Linda Perry - don't care
Phil Spector - in jail
Arif Mardin - dead, but what a legacy and went out on top (Norah Jones).
Bob Clearmountain - not sure
Brian Eno- just produced U2 and Coldplay. Sleeps on a giant pile of money.
Dallas Austin - not sure
Danger Mouse - Beck and the new David Lynch thing
David Briggs - dead, but what a legacy
Terry Date - not sure
Gus Dudgeon - dead, again left a great catalog.
Mitch Easter - just saw his name pop up on something recently.
Jack Douglas - good question. Rehab?
Ahmet Ertegun - dead, but built Atlantic w/ Tom Dowd, his brother, Wexler, Arif, and Joel Dorn. They're all dead now.
Flood - PJ Harvey?
Nigel Godrich - Radiohead and TV show host / roducer
Glyn Johns - semi retired? Still see his name on occasion
Orrin Keepnews - not sure
Gary Katz - ?
Wyclef Jean - care even less than Linda Perry
Eddie Kramer - teaches / speaker. Recent Joe Bonnamossa (sp)?
Mutt Lange - getting over the divorce with Shania. Making sure his money is well hid in Switzerland.
Jimmy Iovine - runs Interscope, has fallen ass backwards up the ladder of life, general has bad taste in music, and likes hats.
Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis - good question. Set up shop in LA a few years back for what?
Daniel Lanois - new U2, recently opened a studio in Toronto, and Chris Whitley's daughter.
Don Landee - good question
Patrick Leonard - not sure
Butch Vig - just did the new Green Day
Steve Albini - always working.
Now that I've answered these you have to go find Ted Templeman and report back to us.
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#659062 - 07/02/09 06:59 PM
Re: What happens to old record producers?
[Re: slider]
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Ditka
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Registered: 01/24/00
Posts: 414
Loc: The Frozen Tundra of Fly Over ...
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George Martin - semi-retired with bad ears
Andrew Loog Oldham - retired to Colombia with his Colombian wife. Has written a few books and you'll see him on occasion at things like SXSW.
Kit Lambert - incredibly dead.
Chris Thomas basically recorded a whole album with U2 that became How to Dismantle... before Lillywhite re-recorded it.
I'm sure he got a lot of "fuck you" money from U2 when they chose to go in another direction with Lillywhite.
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